> John Kirkpatrick > Songs > No, John
No, Sir, No / No John, No
[
Roud 146
/ Song Subject MAS1500
; Master title: No, Sir, No
; Ballad Index R385
; GlosTrad
Roud 146
; Wiltshire
712
, 1055
; Folkinfo 560
; DT ONOJOHN
, ONOJOHN2
; Mudcat 1251
; trad.]
Bob Copper: Early to Rise The Copper Family: The Copper Family Song Book Frank Purslow: Marrow Bones James Reeves: The Idiom of the People Stephen Sedley: The Seeds of Love Cecil J. Sharp: One Hundred English Folksongs
The Stoneman Family recorded The Spanish Merchant’s Daughter on 31 October 1928 in Bristol, Tennessee for the 10" shellac record Victor V-40206. This recording was included in 1952 on Folkways’s Anthology of American Folk Music Volume Three: Songs and in 2015 on the Nehi anthology of British songs in the USA, My Bonnie Lies Over the Ocean. Steve Roud noted:
One of a group of dialogue songs between sweethearts, with the young man doing his best to win the girl’s heart, or at least her consent, but instead of just piling on the offers of mere tempting things, this one cleverly centres on the verbal trick of getting ‘no’ to mean ‘yes’. There were several songs on the same theme printed in Britain on broadsides in the 17th century, but these are not our song which, in its present form, only seems to date from the mid-19th century. It was equally popular with traditional singers on both sides of the Atlantic.
Emily Sparkes sang No, Sir, No to John Howson in Rattlesden, Suffolk, in 1958/59. This recording was included in 1993 on the Veteran cassette and in 2009 on the Veteran CD Many a Good Horseman. John Howson noted:
Cecil Sharp collected a version of O No, John and it was published in Folk Songs From Somerset in 1908. It was republished in Novello’s School Songs and in Vol. 2 of the Selected Edition of English Folk Songs in 1921. As a result, Sharp’s version, albeit with altered words to make it suitable for schoolchildren, became one of the most well known songs in the country. The song has been widely collected and appears in other forms often called Ripest Apples or Twenty, Eighteen. Emily’s version is slightly truncated, with no mention of tying the garter or the couple actually making it to bed, but for the full story listen to Sam Larner on Now Is the Time for Fishing.
Sam Larner sang No Sir, No Sir at home in Winterton, Norfolk, to Ewan MacColl and Peggy Seeger in 1959-60. This recording was published in 1961 on his Folkways album Now Is the Time for Fishing. The accompanying booklet noted:
My Man John, Twenty Eighteen and No, John are all related to this somewhat bawdy piece. More distant relatives are those singing games, The Keys of Heaven and Lady on the Mountain. The most closely related versions, however, are American, Uh-uh, No and Merchant’s Daughter, which latter was recorded for Folkways by the Stoneman family and bears an uncanny similarity in text and tune to that in this album.
Jim Copper of Rottingdean, Sussex, sang No, John, No on 1 March 1951 to Séamus Ennus (BBC 16063). Another 1950s recording of Bob and Ron Copper singing No, John, No made by Peter Kennedy was included on the anthology Songs of Courtship (The Folk Songs of Britain Volume 1; Caedmon 1961; Topic 1968). And John, Bob and Ron Copper sang it in 1971 on the Copper Family’s Leader album A Song for Every Season. The Caedmon album’s booklet commented:
A purely English piece, known in several forms on both sides of the Atlantic. No, John, No was arranged and bowdlerised by Cecil Sharp, who had, unfortunately, to bow to the prudishness of his age. It became a national school song and was sung to death by school-marms. Before the chilly hand of respectability fell upon it, however, No, John, No contained some lusty stanzas:
Madam, shall I tie your garter,
Tie it a little above your knee?
If my hand should slip a little farther,
Would you think amiss of me?
No, John, no, John, no, John, no.My love and I went to bed together;
There we lay till the cocks did crow.
Unclose your arms, my dearest jewel;
Unclose your arms and let me go.
No, John, no, John, no, John, no.
Isla Cameron and Tony Britton sang Oh, No John, No John, No! in 1962 on their Transatlantic album Songs of Love, Lust and Loose Living.
Roy Bailey sang No Sir No, “from Marrow Bones”, in 1971 on his eponymous Trailer album Roy Bailey.
Dave Williams sang No Sir, No at Fo’c’s’le Folk Club, Southampton, in 1974. This recording was included in 2003 on his posthumous Forest Tracks anthology You’re On Nipper!. Paul Marsh noted:
This song, which many of us learned at school, has greater meaning brought to it when it is given the full Dave Williams treatment. much to the delight of an enthusiastic Fo’c’s’le audience.
Jean Redpath sang No, Sir on her 1976 Trailer album There Were Minstrels. She noted:
One of many variants of O, no John, most of which seem to be English, this one also comes to me from my mother’s side of the family.
John Kirkpatrick and Maggie Goodall sang No John in 1984 on the album The Old Songs.
Gordon Hall sang No Sir No in a home recording made in the early 1990s that he included on his cassette anthology Warts & Hall.
Crucible sang Fair Maid Walking (No Sir No) in 2005 on their WildGoose CD Crux. They noted:
Gav[in Davenport] remembers hearing his dad sing this song when he was young, and this version comes from the singing of Steve Gardham of Hull. The girl in the song is smart enough to use her “no means no” to get exactly what she wants.
James Findlay sang No Sir No on his 2009 CD As I Carelessly Did Stray. He noted:
There you have it, an all-round happy song collected in sunny Dorset. This kind of courtship, unique to these parts, can still be seen displayed in some parts of rural Dorset; also in Weymouth’s clubs and seafront bars on Friday and Saturday nights.
Gavin Davenport sang No Sir No! also with the Albion Band in 2011 on their EP Fighting Room.
Bernie Cherry sang No, Sir, No on his 2009 Musical Traditions CD With Powder, Shot and Gun. Rod Stradling noted:
This is quite a well-known song, with 125 Roud entries, roughly shared between England and North America; only one example each seems to have been collected in Ireland and Scotland. It must have remained popular into the recent past as there are 36 sound recordings listed, though very few have ever been published. None are currently availa ble on CD, although there are two slightly different versions of the song, called Ripest Apples , sung by Joe Jones (MTCD320), and Twenty Eighteen, sung by George Townshend (MTCD3045).
Bernie: As any politician can tell you, it’s not what you ask but how you ask it that matters! Another from Sam Larner.
Lyrics
Bob and Ron Copper sing No, John
On yonder hill there lives a lady
But her name I do not know,
I’ll go and court her for her beauty,
Whether she answers yes or no.
Chorus (repeated after each verse):
No John no, no John no,
No John, no John, no John no!
She is a fair and handsome creature
And to woo her I will go.
I will ask her if she’ll be my true love,
Will she answer yes or no?
If when walking in the garden
Plucking flowers all wet with dew,
Tell me will you be offended
If I walk and talk with you?
Tell me one thing tell me truly,
Tell me why you scorn me so,
Tell me why, when asked a question
That you always answer No?
My father was a Spanish merchant
And before he went to sea,
He told me to be sure to answer
No to all you said to me,
And if when walking in the garden
I should ask you to be mine,
If I tell you that I love you
Would you then my love decline?
Emily Sparkes sings No, Sir, No
Tell me one thing, tell me truly
Tell me why you scorn me so,
Tell me why, when asked a question,
You will always answer ‘No’.
Chorus (repeated after each verse):
No sir, no sir, no sir, no-oh-oh-oh
No sir, no sir, no sir, no.
My father was a Spanish merchant,
And before he went away,
He told me to be sure and answer,
‘No’ to all that you should say.
If while walking in the garden,
Plucking flowers all wet with dew,
Tell me, wouldn’t you be offended
If I pluck-ed one for you?
And if while walking in the garden,
I should ask you to be mine,
Tell me would you be offended.
Would you then my heart decline?
John Kirkpatrick and Maggie Goodall sing No, John
On yonder hill there stands a creature
Who she is I do not know;
I’ll go and court her for her beauty,
She must answer yes or no.
Chorus (repeated after each verse):
Oh, no, John, no John,
No, John, no!
On her bosom are bunches of posies,
On her breast where flowers grow.
If I should chance to touch that posy
She must answer yes or no.
Madam, I am come for to court you
If your favour I can gain.
Come and sat yourself down alongside me
I fear I should never see you again.
My husband he was a Spanish captain,
Went to sea a month ago.
The very last time that we kissed and parted
Bid me always answer “No!”
Madam, in your face is beauty,
In your bosom flowers grow,
In your bedroom there is pleasure,
Shall I view it? Yes or no.
Madam, shall I tie your garter,
Tie it a little above your knee?
If my hand should slip a little farther,
Would you think it amiss of me?
My love and I went to bed together,
There we lay till the cocks did crow;
Unclose your arms, my dearest jewel,
Unclose your arms and let me go.
Bernie Cherry sings No, Sir, No
In London city there lived a lady
And her age I do not know
I courted her, all for her beauty
But she would always answer “No.
No Sir, no Sir, no Sir, no Sir.”
For she would always answer “No Sir, no.”
Her husband was a Spanish captain
Seven long years had been away
And the last time that he left her
He bade her always to say nay.
“Oh madam may I walk your garden
Walk and talk as lovers do
And madam would you think it rudely
If I plucked a rose and pinned on you?”
“Oh madam may I tie your garter
Just one inch above your knee
And if my hand it should slip higher
Would you think it rude of me?”
“Oh madam would you strip stark naked
Go to bed as lovers do
And madam would you think it rudely
If I undressed and came with you?”
And now we are in bed together
Gazing on each other’s charms
“Would your own husband please you better
If he lay all in your arms?”
“Madam arise, draw back the curtains
The morning cock is crowing high
Madam arise draw back those curtains
Unclasp your arms and let me fly.”